Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

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shewelt
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Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

Post by shewelt » Sat Oct 22, 2011 5:37 pm

I posted this in the LNG section, but maybe belongs here.

I'm new to this forum, and just read a great article here on LNG use for fleet vehicles & fueling / operation issues:

LNG Issues

From the reading, it sounds like the failure mode is understood, and isolated to the economizer valve and single line filling practices. It also appears there is history of documented failures, which lead to this solution. The last sentence in the article references:

"Only Cryogenic Fuels Inc appears to provide an LNG system that incorporates the above considerations at this time".

Many of the engine burn-downs are giving LNG a bad name, which likely helps big-oil squash the progress. If 2-line filling solves the known issue that causes engine failure, why has this not become the standard that all are seeking out? Seem like the savings in costs of fuel, and engine repair would automatically make this method very attractive?

Is it politics, money....both? Very perplexing....

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Steptoe
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Re: Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

Post by Steptoe » Sun Oct 23, 2011 12:28 am

You link doesnt work and I can find no reference to it in the search function.
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Frank
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Re: Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

Post by Frank » Sun Oct 23, 2011 12:13 pm

shwelt, welcome to the forum! I fixed the link and deleted the other topic you started in the natural gas section.

I don't think politics has anything to do with the technical aspects of LNG. I think politicians just go by what industry leaders (lobbyists?) tell them. I believe that the reason the single line fill system is so common-place is that it is based on an industrial system which then became the basis for automotive systems. When LNG was first being implemented, I also believe it was just easier to the fuel suppliers to modify their existing systems than to start off with a clean sheet.

shewelt
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Re: Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

Post by shewelt » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:25 pm

Thank you for fixing the link.

Could be just a transfer of technology from industrial systems was part of the early transition to vehicle fueling. However, the article points out the shortcomings are well known in the technology today. What was acceptable for industrial, is now causing commonplace failures of engines when used for vehicle fueling systems.

A record of destroyed engines sure doesn't instill confidence in the supporting public, while providing ammunition to lobbyists for big-oil. There has to be a technological movement to go towards a proven fueling infrastructure before Natural Gas (LNG) is accepted as the alternative fuel.

Maybe it's still early, but I thought for sure when Diesel fuel was around $5/gal the writing was on the wall & things would move quicker. Looking like we could still be decades away. Hope I'm wrong.

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Steptoe
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Re: Actually solving LNG issues & leaving out politics

Post by Steptoe » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:18 am

We had CNG as a pump fuel in the 1980s here...
I meant very large investment on local compressors and filling equipment.
The down side and what eventually 'killed' cng was that unlike LPG runs rather effectively on a petrol engine ..without basic mods like compression, requireing special rebuilding of engines, CNG is basicallu gutless at low compression.
Then to build a CNG engine, and run duel fuel, th high compression plays havac with todays fuels ..detnation etc.
Then to top that off the range ...well to put mildly...sucks...from memory I had a 80L tank and that had a range of around 60/70 miles....but was even far cheaper than LPG....if it was free I think we would still have seen its demise
So after thebig flurish of alternative fuels LPG and CNG) after the fuel crisis in the late 70s by the time the early 90s rolled on the last of the automotive filling stations where closed down.
Not because of political or corporate reasons, but simly because of inconvience and lack of demand.
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