Who Killed the Electric Car?

Got an opinion about fuels, energy, or emissions that you'd like to share or to start a debate?
Frank
Site Admin
Posts: 861
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:17 pm
Location: Stevensville, ON
Contact:

Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Frank » Mon Feb 12, 2007 9:04 am

While at the video store picking up some movies for the children, I noticed a DVD on the rack entitled "Who Killed the Electric Car?". Naturally, I had to bring this movie home for myself. I found this movie to be thought-provoking and I highly recommend it.

Being in Canada, GM's EV1 and Ford's Th!nkelectric car never made the headlines. For those who don't know, the EV1 was the result of CARB's Zero Emission Vehicle (ZEV) program. It seems that CARB has shifted their focus from electric vehicles to hydrogen fuel cells. The switch seems to me to be a huge step backwards because the technological hurdles yet to be overcome with hydrogen. The ability to refuel overnight at home without a special Vehicle Refuelling Appliance or additional infrastructure is a major advantage for the electric car.

The movie showed that the vehicles were extremely popular with their owners and many were dismayed when GM took them back to be crushed without even giving the owners a chance to buy out or re-lease their cars. It is disappointing to see CARB cave in to corporate interests and regress in their mission and goals.


Frank
Site Admin
Posts: 861
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:17 pm
Location: Stevensville, ON
Contact:

Before and After

Post by Frank » Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:15 am

GM's EV1 archived web site:
http://www.evchargernews.com/CD-A/gm_ev1_web_site/


GM's "new" Volt electric concept car web site:
http://www.chevrolet.com/electriccar/

mopar1
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri May 25, 2007 10:55 am
Location: Lebanon, Indiana

Post by mopar1 » Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:57 am

I watched that show on satellite TV also. I never heard that much about them when it was happening either.

turbine guy
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue May 06, 2008 10:51 pm
Location: Fort St. John, BC Canada

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by turbine guy » Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:52 pm

Time to revive this subject from the dead. I bought a Ford Focus Electric, and am using it as my daily commuter; -27c here the other day, and so far, "Sparky" is working fine. Locally we get our power from a local 3.2gWe hydro electric dam, which is pretty darn green. In the summer, I plan to charge off my 1.1kWe solar panal array, so I can purely "drive off the sun". (To offset the debate that electric cars simply defer carbon emissions from the tailpipe to the smokestack.)
In summer, my avaerage range was 141km, with my driving habits. On the coldest days so far this winter, this was reduced to 60km, but my daily requirements from driving is still well under this. I have a charging station at home, and at work.
Propane and electric, my (vehicle) consience is clear.

storm
Posts: 558
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:10 pm
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by storm » Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:29 pm

I don't get why electric cars cannot be self charging. I realise it takes a fair bit to charge them but can't they have an altinator/generator type assemby on each wheel and/or driveshaft? For places like Australia with huge distances of empty roads a self charging electric car would revolutionise our family car style transport. Until then they will remain something that only people who mainly commute short distances in towns/regional centres or in drive in metropolitan areas would buy.
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who did it. Autograph your work with excellence.

Fuel flow requirements calculations viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1638

Frank
Site Admin
Posts: 861
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:17 pm
Location: Stevensville, ON
Contact:

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Frank » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:00 pm

I think self-charging is what GM was thinking when they built the Volt.

User avatar
Steptoe
Posts: 1482
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:32 pm
Location: JAFA , New Zealand

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Steptoe » Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:54 am

For places like Australia with huge distances of empty roads a self charging electric car would revolutionise our family car style transport
Solar panel roof and hood... in Aussie those big distances, and that unfiltered dry sun....
My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'

Frank
Site Admin
Posts: 861
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:17 pm
Location: Stevensville, ON
Contact:

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Frank » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:40 am

Even if photovoltaic cells were 100% efficient, I don't think the roof of any car would be able to collect enough power to maintain a reasonable road speed. Besides, what would happen from dusk to dawn?

Rather than storing power in on-board batteries, I think it would be better to store renewable energy chemically. This would allow this energy to be used when and where is needed rather than whenever and where-ever the sun shines and the wind blows.

User avatar
Steptoe
Posts: 1482
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:32 pm
Location: JAFA , New Zealand

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Steptoe » Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:52 pm

don't think the roof of any car would be able to collect enough power to maintain a reasonable road speed. Besides, what would happen from dusk to dawn?
I would agree, there would not ne enough energy to maintain, but rather help sustain battery charge levels.
Aussie out back, it is not advised to drive at night...hit a roo, is like hitting a deer, except in Aussie u are in extreme desert conditions a very long way from any where.
My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'

storm
Posts: 558
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:10 pm
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by storm » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:33 pm

Steptoe wrote:Solar panel roof and hood... in Aussie those big distances, and that unfiltered dry sun....
Frank wrote:Even if photovoltaic cells were 100% efficient, I don't think the roof of any car would be able to collect enough power to maintain a reasonable road speed. Besides, what would happen from dusk to dawn?
Steptoe wrote:I would agree, there would not ne enough energy to maintain, but rather help sustain battery charge levels.
I know there are Solar car challenges in various countries and Australia has one from Darwin in the north to Adelaide in the south. Yes they drive through the day and the sun only charges at that time but if they had power generation that could keep the batteries maintained then they could also drive at night.
Steptoe wrote:Aussie out back, it is not advised to drive at night...hit a roo, is like hitting a deer, except in Aussie u are in extreme desert conditions a very long way from any where.
Sorry to put a damper on this but that is just wrong. There are more roo's in non remote rural areas than there are in the outback and you are actually safer driving at night in the outback than in non-remote rural areas.
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who did it. Autograph your work with excellence.

Fuel flow requirements calculations viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1638

User avatar
Steptoe
Posts: 1482
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:32 pm
Location: JAFA , New Zealand

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by Steptoe » Sat Dec 22, 2012 3:23 pm

The car club did a run from the back wheels in the indian ocean to front wheels in the tasman....
Several times now both ways.
Vintage cars cruising around 45 /50 mph.....roos where a problem, not everywhere, and warning signs not uncommon. and so where the road trains and small light vintage cars.
My Spelling is Not Incorrect...It's 'Creative'

storm
Posts: 558
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:10 pm
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by storm » Sat Dec 22, 2012 3:31 pm

:roll: Steptoe, this is not a points scoring game and even if it was you would not win it :wink:

I live here, have lived in Darwin and in South Australia, and driven the outback rather extensively. Kangaroos are not the problem you say they are, you have more chance of hitting one where I currently live in northern NSW just off the western side of the Great Divide than you do in the outback.
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who did it. Autograph your work with excellence.

Fuel flow requirements calculations viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1638

storm
Posts: 558
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:10 pm
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by storm » Sun Dec 23, 2012 4:09 am

Some Kangaroo pics outside, off my verandah. This is only a small part of only 1 group, of many, that live on and near my property. You have more chance of hitting a roo outside my gate than you do anywhere in the Australian outback.
Attachments
20121223_193540-1.jpg
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who did it. Autograph your work with excellence.

Fuel flow requirements calculations viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1638

131
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:24 am
Location: Tasmania, Australia.

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by 131 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:52 am

storm wrote:I don't get why electric cars cannot be self charging.
Basic physics doesn't allow it, otherwise we'd have perpetual motion machines. It takes more power to turn a generator than it puts out, at best solar panels are about 20% efficient, wind turbines create drag, heat, noise, drag, friction are all losses.
Cheers,

Mick.

storm
Posts: 558
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:10 pm
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Who Killed the Electric Car?

Post by storm » Thu May 16, 2013 11:14 pm

131 wrote:
storm wrote:I don't get why electric cars cannot be self charging.
Basic physics doesn't allow it, otherwise we'd have perpetual motion machines. It takes more power to turn a generator than it puts out, at best solar panels are about 20% efficient, wind turbines create drag, heat, noise, drag, friction are all losses.
By what you are saying the new technology in Mazda's that takes energy generated in the process of braking (slowing down) and feeds that into the electric system shouldn't even exist. We are limited by our own desire to make these things not by "basic physics".
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who did it. Autograph your work with excellence.

Fuel flow requirements calculations viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1638

Post Reply